Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

TinySpock 4/2/2015, 8:05 pm

I was perusing the posts and I read some disparaging comments about bagged Mel's Mix. I was so thrilled to find that I didn't have to mix the soil myself, that Mel had pre-mixed bags available for sale. Should I be amending his mix? What's the problem?

The one thing I do notice about his mix is that there seems to be very little vermiculite in it. Now, I'm a big fan of vermiculite. It has crossed my mind that I would like to buy a big bag of vermiculite to augment my TT's filled with Mel's Mix.

Another thing, my composting efforts have failed big-time, so much that I've given up. What kind of compost is the best to buy? Brands? Any help would be appreciated!

**kauairosina** 4/2/2015, 9:07 pm

I'm not sure where you read about the negatives of Mel's premix. We ordered some from Amazon when we first started and it worked just fine. It came to my post office box in huge cardboard boxes, falling apart, but. as I recall we were very happy to have it.

You might check around and see if a local nursery makes compost. We have ordered large amounts from our local nursery but this in the range of truckloads for a new large garden so I don't know about smaller amounts.

**sanderson** 4/2/2015, 11:23 pm

Nature's Way SFG Mix by Growell, at Home Depot, should be good. It is endorsed by Mel. Gardening supplies are transported and delivered in large lots on pallets. The journey may be hot or cold, long or short, maybe some good microbes die by the time you get it. Give the mix a good soaking in it's new home and the good microbes should start to "revive."

**camprn** 4/3/2015, 5:33 am

One would be better off making their own. There is currently no standard or guiding rules regarding growing mix ingredients or amounts of specific ingredients to be used. If you make your own, you will know what is in it. If you need more of 'something' for your mix, I recommend adding more compost. Adding more vermiculite will not increase the mix fertility.

**sanderson** 4/3/2015, 12:53 pm

camprn wrote:One would be better off making their own. There is currently no standard or guiding rules regarding growing mix ingredients or amounts of specific ingredients to be used. If you make your own, you will know what is in it. If you need more of 'something' for your mix, I recommend adding more compost. Adding more vermiculite will not increase the mix fertility.

+1

TinySpock 4/3/2015, 1:42 pm

The additional vermiculite was for water-holding, not for fertility. I will try to find the forum post that I read about MM.

thanks

**sanderson** 4/3/2015, 2:01 pm

Don't forget. Because you are in AZ, you need to leave free space at the top for mulch. You are in AZ sunny

and will need it! Mulch will be what saves the precious water from surface evaporation. My recommendation is to not add more vermiculite but to focus on the surface.

TinySpock 4/3/2015, 8:30 pm

Very good advice, S - mulch would let the exiting vermiculite do it's job. I'm going to Home Depot tomorrow, what kind would you suggest?

**sanderson** 4/3/2015, 9:19 pm

For 2 years I used virgin pine/fir chips from a Stone and rock store called playground mulch. This year I am using a bale of bedding straw from an Ag feed store that I cut into 4-6" pieces.

The problem about "mulch" from HD is that it is either redwood (no-no) chips or bark, or dyed hardwood.

TinySpock 4/3/2015, 9:24 pm

sanderson wrote:For 2 years I used virgin pine/fir chips from a Stone and rock store called playground mulch. This year I am using a bale of bedding straw from an Ag feed store that I cut into 4-6" pieces.

The problem about "mulch" from HD is that it is either redwood (no-no) chips or bark, or dyed hardwood.

Oh, another good-to-know thing! Thanks. Just FMI, why no-no on redwood chips?

**camprn** 4/3/2015, 9:39 pm

I really like shredded bark mulch for in beds. It's easy to move because it kind of so es up in mats.

**sanderson** 4/3/2015, 10:08 pm

Camp, What kind of bark do you have back East? We have redwood which is painful if you get even the tiniest splinter. Plus it is acidic.

**camprn** 4/3/2015, 10:37 pm

sanderson wrote:Camp, What kind of bark do you have back East? We have redwood which is painful if you get even the tiniest splinter. Plus it is acidic.

Usually pine bark. One thing I like about the bark is it doesnt tie up the precious nitrogen in the top portion of the Mel's mix which helps with the shallow rooted veggies.

Tiny Spock, did you get your original questions answered? Do you have any others about Mel's mix?

**Turan** 4/3/2015, 11:41 pm

Tinyspock, your pictures of your garden after 8 weeks is a fine case of MM of any source (home made or bagged) doing well. Now to keep it going as the temperature increases. I gather mulch, shade and good watering is key. There are threads by others in your region that I am sure you have been studying.
Best of growing luck Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much? 3170584802

Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much? 3170584802

**sfg4uKim** 4/4/2015, 8:23 am

While home made MM is of course the best, the #1 thing that stops many people from using the SFG method is . . . making Mel's Mix. Even if they attempt to make it themselves but just can't find FIVE different bagged composts, they make it incorrectly using just two bags (probably filled with peat) and get discouraging results. Then they badmouth the SQUARE FOOT GARDENING method.

The next biggest failure of the SFG method is incorrect initial set up - putting in 2" of MM, TONS of water, 2" of MM, TONS of water, 2" of MM, TONS of water. If not done correctly and they get discouraging results . . . they badmouth the SQUARE FOOT GARDENING method.

I believe that the Nature's Way/Gro-Well mix will be a good product to use since the creator of the method, MEL BARTHOLOMEW, endorses it. Let's trust that he and the Foundation will keep Gro-Well in line by frequent quality control checks.

**Turan** 4/4/2015, 12:01 pm

I suspect that Mel and the SFG Foundation were way too trusting at first. Kim, do you know what kind of over sight/testing they now have in place to ensure a good product?

Tinyspock, I seem to recall hearing good things here about Black Kow and Black Hen and Chickity doo-doo and Quoddy Lobster Compost. I am sure people who use them will speak up.

**AtlantaMarie** 4/4/2015, 1:19 pm

We use cypress mulch (also available at HD) because it lasts a long time.

But I will also say this: This year I am putting down a thick layer of newspaper between the MM & mulch to make easier mulch pickup at the end of the season.

**sanderson** 4/4/2015, 1:50 pm

Marie, some one recommended a very thin layer of composted manure before laying down "brown" mulch, so the mulch doesn't rob the MM of nitrogen. Last summer I tried a thin layer of composted bagged manure, then some tulle, then topped with wood chips. I think it really worked well but putting the tulle in a box was difficult. Shocked

Easy for potted plants, because I used a circle of tulle with a slit to the center so I could wrap it around the single pepper plant. Just a thought.

Elizabeth 4/4/2015, 2:07 pm

On the subject of mulch - PINE STRAW!!

A THICK layer - 12". Pat it down. Excellent for water retention and the best weed blocking mulch available. It decomposes slowly so you do not need as much to replenish. It is easy to remove. Contrary to popular belief it DOES NOT adversely affect your pH.

Please do not use Cypress mulch. Cypress is a southern treasure. There are no more first growth Cypress trees. It is difficult to find second growth trees.

I love my swamps and marshes. Old Cypress trees take my breathe away. G knows of some places in the swamps that we can get to by boat - very difficultly and carefully - where there are stunning second growth Cypress groves. They are so beautiful that it is almost a religious experience to slowly move through the groves.

plantoid 4/4/2015, 3:39 pm

TinySpock wrote:The additional vermiculite was for water-holding, not for fertility. I will try to find the forum post that I read about MM.

The vermiculite is only for the initial charge of Mel's mix & first the topping up of the bed as it will settle down in the first few days /weeks .
After that it's best using your own home made compost. Using MM formula gives you time to get you own composting method up running and producing the final goods.

You will be gently replacing the consumed bed growth medium a trowel at a time in each newly harvested square , as it breaks down & is used up by the plants .

The fiberous nature of the well made home made compost is an even better material for soaking up water , retaining air and holding nutrients as this form of compost carries on decaying & presenting the vital plant nutrients tom the plants .

The continuous adding of well made new home made compost in each newly harvested square keeps the gardening cycle going in tip top condition.

**sanderson** 4/4/2015, 3:48 pm

We are off topic here, and I am one of the guilty ones. Embarassed

Back to pre-made Mel's Mix.

**Turan** 4/4/2015, 3:58 pm

TinySpock wrote:I was perusing the posts and I read some disparaging comments about bagged Mel's Mix. I was so thrilled to find that I didn't have to mix the soil myself, that Mel had pre-mixed bags available for sale. Should I be amending his mix? What's the problem?

The one thing I do notice about his mix is that there seems to be very little vermiculite in it. Now, I'm a big fan of vermiculite. It has crossed my mind that I would like to buy a big bag of vermiculite to augment my TT's filled with Mel's Mix.

Another thing, my composting efforts have failed big-time, so much that I've given up. What kind of compost is the best to buy? Brands? Any help would be appreciated!

Here is the OP, more topics than just about commercial MM.

**AtlantaMarie** 4/4/2015, 5:04 pm

Yeah, yeah... Me too!!! Guilty... Embarassed

As usual...!

**walshevak** 4/6/2015, 1:44 pm

I don't remember where the posts about the original pre-made MM are, but I do remember that folks were having growth problems with their plants. If I remember right, fertilizer (even Miracle-Gro) and/or top dressing was recommended until the squares needed replanting. It worked. Then homemade and/or a blend of commercial composts were added and the problems went away. The newer mix may not have the problems of the original mix, but just to be safe, I'd have some blend on hand for top dressing.

Since we have to add new compost every year, I just got into the habit of buying some good composts including worm castings from my worm bin and keeping an 18 gal tote full out by the beds (in my case under the TTs). Then I could get a couple of buckets from the compost pile and some from the bin when replanting.

Kay

**kauairosina** 4/6/2015, 2:29 pm

Nan from Kailua asked me what TT stood for and I couldn't tell her. Told her to tell me next time she saw it and Walshevak used the term today. I thought maybe table tops but don't know. Please let us know. Many thanks.

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Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

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Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?

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Re: Did I hear correctly? Mel's (pre)Mix - not so much?


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