Yellowing of Leaves

Haven't had this happen with my old setup:
-16 Hrs light with T-20 cool fluorescent bulbs, plants within 2 inches
-Soil was Bumper Crop Organic Soil Amendment (not even what is supposed to be used, stupid of me, but the stuff is probably SUPER nutrient dense)
-Plastic Cups /w little drainage
-No fan
-Overwatered

New setup:
-15 Hrs light with (4) T-5 fluorescent bulbs, plants within 6-8 inches
-Soil is Mel's Mix from Veteran Compost
-Actual Seedling Cups /w good drainage
-Fan blowing a super gentle breeze, set on the same 15 Hr cycle as the lights

I feel like I'm doing everything right now, and I have 12 Broccoli growing right now... Only 1 or 2 of these babies are turning a bit yellow // why could these leaves be looking kinda yellow - lack of water? lack of nutrients in the soil? too powerful a light? not enough light? light too far away (doubt it, this new light is super strong and if I keep it any closer, the leaves will get tip burn)?

I'm thinking of going and getting this soil tested.





(hehe, you can see my fingerprints on that leaf -- I didn't pinch it hard either I promise!)

New gardeners who are trying to grow plants from seeds often over water, which can be deadly to plants. Beware of over watering. How often are you watering now?

I would say once every three days or so... I usually wait for the soil to get super dry, then water from above until dripping comes out the bottom, and then won't water again until the MM is bone dry

The mix should not become bone dry, this will just dessicate the small root hairs. Water a little less at a time because you do not want the nutrients to wash out of the soil mix in the small cells. Does the plant have new leaves sprouting?

Yes, they look healthy, just a tad washed out, and are producing leaves with no problem

That's very good! If the discolored leaves become worse, just pinch them off the plant, new leaves will take their place.  

Looks like a magnesium deficiency to me. Add a pinch of Epsom salts to a pint of non-chlorinated water and water it through- don't let the container sit in water any longer than 10 minutes at a time, as this can leach out minerals by osmotic pressure.

Okay things have gotten worse since I've been gone...



This yellow dude is now shriveled up and getting dry/crackly on the edges -- is this from lack of water? Lack of nutrients? Too close to my T-5 lights?



This never happened with my old setup, which I would think was way worse / way more inexperienced of a setup.

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Also, some of these leaves are looking weird with yellow spots



Yellow dots...



Leaf folding in on the edges...

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Whereas all of my other plants look like this!



I can't figure it out?! Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Oh geez -- and I just thought of something else that could be way different that I'm doing now that I wasn't doing before...

The pH of the water coming out of my sink @ my house is really low ~ 4.0

What I've been doing in the past is using water from my Water Dispenser (the water that comes out of those blue water jug type machines) which has a pH of around ~7.0+, and then I've been mixing a bit of sink water into it to make the water between 6.3 and 6.8

Without even thinking about it, I had been filling the water up into large beer mugs and leaving them to sit out for 24 hrs to get to room temperature, as Mel says that it's best to water the plants with room temperature water -- I didn't even realize that at the same time, I was also LETTING THE CHLORINE EVAPORATE!

Most recently, I bought these spray bottles and I've been mixing the water right into the spray bottles and then capping the spray bottles off, which probably isn't letting the chlorine in the drinking water evaporate -- THIS COULD BE why my plants are looking so weird... Any thoughts on this?! Maybe for now on, if I'm going to be using the drinking water from my water dispenser, I need to make sure that I'm leaving the water out for 24+ hrs before feeding my plants so that I can be rest assured that all of the chlorine has evaporated; does it sound like I may have just cracked the code?  

My water is chlorinated.  I never heard of de-chlorinating it before using it on seedlings.  I de-chlorinate it when I put it on my compost pile but not for watering plants or seedlings.

Is it possible that the MM that I have is too nutrient dense? I had someone come and look at my setup and they said for one, they recommended my MM be mixed with regular topsoil because it's too nutrient dense, and two, it's too loose and water is going to constantly run right through it. Some of my seedlings are coming along strong, some of them have leaves that are shriveling up and dying, and some of the leaves are either tacoing up and/or folding in on themselves.

Please remember that Mel's Mix does not include top soil. You were incorrectly advised.

What did you use to make your Mel's Mix?  Did you have five different composts? Which ones?  Did any of them contain a lot of uncomposted wood products? Did you use vermiculite--or perlite?

It's essential to have five (or more) composts.  Uncomposted wood robs the plants of nitrogen.  

I agree with Mel that vermiculite is superior to perlite for the following reason:  Perlite encourages drainage, although it does hold some moisture.  Vermiculite, on the other hand, holds a great deal of moisture, and when saturated, allows that moisture to drain gradually.

tumtumsback wrote:Is it possible that the MM that I have is too nutrient dense? I had someone come and look at my setup and they said for one, they recommended my MM be mixed with regular topsoil because it's too nutrient dense, and two, it's too loose and water is going to constantly run right through it. Some of my seedlings are coming along strong, some of them have leaves that are shriveling up and dying, and some of the leaves are either tacoing up and/or folding in on themselves.

Did this person giving you advice actually have knowledge of what they were talking about? It seems that this person clearly didn't understand the basics of the SFG and Mel's mix. DId they give you examples of what made them think these things? Was there any rationale offered?

Many folks like to give advice and frankly, that person was giving you bad advice.

Have you been watering more regularly and not allowing the mix to dry out as before? Is the new growth looking strong and green? HAve there been any drastic changes in the past 5 days? MAybe you can post an updated photo..

TumTum,  Update photos will help here.

Do not add top soil!!!      No dirt allowed!  Properly made MM works = 1/3 vermiculite or perlite, 1/3 fluffed peat moss, and 1/3 Five-Source compost.  What did you use to make your compost?  We are here to help you be a SF Gardener!   

PS,  Don't worry if the first set of leaves turn yellow.  They aren't the True leaves anyway.  The second set and on are true leaves.

http://www.veterancompost.com/our-products-1/

This is where I got my MM, recommended through this forum.

"Square Foot Gardening Mix - $8.50/cubic foot bag, $175/yard
This container mix is great for anyone using raised beds, especially those doing Square Foot Gardening. It is 1/3 compost, 1/3 peat moss and 1/3 coarse vermiculite.
 
This is THE recipe prescribed for Square Foot Gardening, so if you were looking to make your own, you might want to save yourself some trouble and buy in pre-mixed!"

I assume the 1/3 compost is basically made up of food scraps and wood scraps and manure... I have no way of telling though... A lot of the wood scraps are NOT fully composted, which is why some of these babies could be doing good and others not so much... The ones that aren't doing good could have a higher concentration of uncomposted wood scraps in their contained seedling pot.

It's really sad because I have a batch of Broccoli seedlings that I started too early, but kept it going for kicks to learn how to start from seed, and that batch is doing SO much better than this new batch of Broccoli which is being grown STRICTLY in this stuff: http://www.coastofmaine.com/mn-bumpercrop.shtml

No vermiculite whatsoever in the old batch... And they are doing amazing -- I think I just got robbed by this "Veteran Compost" dude... There was still silverware (forks, knives) and plastic straws and all sorts of stuff in my compost. NOT a good way to get introduced to SFG...  

tumtumsback wrote:
It's really sad because I have a batch of Broccoli seedlings that I started too early, but kept it going for kicks to learn how to start from seed, and that batch is doing SO much better than this new batch of Broccoli which is being grown STRICTLY in this stuff: http://www.coastofmaine.com/mn-bumpercrop.shtml

No vermiculite whatsoever in the old batch... And they are doing amazing -- I think I just got robbed by this "Veteran Compost" dude... There was still silverware (forks, knives) and plastic straws and all sorts of stuff in my compost. NOT a good way to get introduced to SFG...  

Veteran's compost has mixed the product according to Mel's recipe and you are having problems, please contact them if you are unsatisfied.

To be fair, the Coast of Main product you planted in is all compost and not Mel's mix so it's not an equal comparison.

Please post a photo of anything you are continuing to have trouble with and perhaps we can help, but if you feel it is the Veteran's Mel's mix there is nothing we can do to help you.
Or you could add some Coast of Maine compost to the Mel's mix.

Here is an overview of all of my Broccoli seedlings



This one is starting to form pits


This one is drying out on the edges and yellowing


This one is pitted and drying out




This is an example of what the other good ones look like -- I have about 6 of these healthy ones

Pinch off the yellowing and dried out leaves, they aren't doing the plant any good. Has your watering become more regular and not allowing the mix to dry out? They really don't look too bad.

Veteran Compost is a forum member, but doesn't sign on much.  Bet bet is to contact the company.

Kay

Scratch everything that I ever said -- his Soil is amazing. My lights were way too powerful! and I was overwatering. #NewbieComplaints