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New Garden Construction/Planning - Page 2 Empty Re: New Garden Construction/Planning

Post  Komanui on 1/12/2012, 1:37 am

Staf74 & janezee, thank you for the replies !!
I do own ANSFG & I was trying to both keep the
weeds down and the soil in; I'm placing cinder
blocks on the ground and the area I live in has
etremely hardy California grass. So I thought
that plastic would better retard the weeds & keep
the soil in. But I changed my design slightly and am going
to dig out the grass and use weed cloth.
Thanks again !!
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New Garden Construction/Planning - Page 2 Empty Possible Layout - Plan

Post  JK on 1/31/2012, 10:39 am

New Garden Construction/Planning - Page 2 New_bi10



Never posted a picture before so maybe this will work... Simple layout in excel that i print screened and put into an image. When you click to see full size image I think it works, still a little hard to see though. I plan to build a trellis at the north side of each box.

Any thoughts or problems with plant layout or spacing or even plant selection? Im pretty much open to anything at this point. Number per plants is based off the spacing in Mel's book if I looked at everything right.
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Post  Furbalsmom on 1/31/2012, 1:48 pm

Looks good JK. Nice planning for the vertical plants.

My only suggestion is for convenience, you might want to put the carrots and onions in the middle as they are longer term crops and then you don't need to reach over them everytime you want to harvest a couple of radishes or some spinach or lettuce leaves from the outside edges.

Are you growing bush type beans and peas? Love them!
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Post  JK on 1/31/2012, 3:09 pm

Thanks, I will move them around a little.

Im not sure what kind yet but yes I am going to try the bush peas and beans since the spacing allows for more. Any recommendations for type? Only beans and peas I have ever dealt with come from the store so I am at a loss as to what kind to even start with. I would like some that are hopefully good producers and that I could harvest/prepare relatively easily.
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Post  jpatti on 1/31/2012, 4:20 pm

I've never grown bush beans or peas, but have noted in seed catalogs that my favorite green bean, Kentucky Blue, comes in a bush variety. I'd also recommend a Romano type as they are particularly yummy.

In both cases, I am referring to fresh beans; if you're looking for dry beans, I like the Calypso best. I don't grow standards like pintos, navy beans, black beans, etc. cause they're just so cheap to buy.

The only peas I grow are sugar snaps and sometimes snow peas, and both are poles, so dunno what to tell you. I don't like English peas and am too lazy to shell them. Wink

IMO, the difference in number of plants is not significant. You can plant 9 bush or 8 pole. Bush plants mostly grow all at once and then stop. Pole beans keep producing the entire season until killed by frost if you keep them picked. So you get a bigger yield from the poles, and more spread out through the season.

The issue is more that you only have so much vertical growing space and other things may be more of a priority for you.

Someday I need to build a 1 by 50 box so I can grow all the vertical crops I want. Wink
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Post  JK on 1/31/2012, 4:32 pm

Space is definitly an issue just starting out. Id love to get as much yield from the garden as I can... not even built and Im already chaffing at the limits lol. I am looking for fresh, I dont think im going to be worried about growing dry type beans anytime soon. To easy to buy and to many other goodies to plant.

Trellis space is definitly at a premium. I absolutly love tomatos and cucumbers, wish there was more room for squash....

I have gotten all of my materials except the trellis material and the fifth type of compost. Slowly inching my way to build time bounce
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Post  rrsmith60 on 1/31/2012, 6:17 pm

All advice sounds good to me.

I may of missed it in the previous postings, but I ALWAYS put wire cloth (hardware cloth ½”) on the bottom of my boxes to keep out those %**&#@$$% moles from eating my garden.

Don’t know if you have sub-terrainial critters out your way, but you might consider it.

I didn’t think they would be a problem here until after my first season.

Had to take out all the MM and redo the boxes for season 2. Five seasons later, no loss to underground varmints.cheers
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Post  JK on 2/1/2012, 8:39 am

The critters are certainly around the area but where I am now it wont be a problem. My soil is such hard packed clay those moles would need more than even nature provides to get through. Im going to put down newspaper under the beds to begin with and let that be it. Hopefully there wont be any complications.

In mels book I see the full wire cage that he puts over a box to keep out critters... is there a way to modify that so it will fit onto a box that has a trellis set up on one end? Or will they simply grow through it and go on the trellis with no problem?

I dont have the funds to add a fence to the project and I have a very regular traffic of deer directly where my garden is going.
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Post  llama momma on 2/1/2012, 9:07 am

JK
You mentioned Mel's critter cover and using a trellis at the same time. Same problem here. I slid the critter cover away from the trellis so the tomatoes, cukes, and beans could freely climb up. At the opposite end the critter cover then hangs off the end of the box making an opening. I put cinder blocks under the critter frame it to block off the opening. But now we're back to the exposed trellised plants. I attached a small bungee cord from the cage to chicken wire around the trellis, around a U post or two to the opposite side of the cage. Simply detach the bungee to tend to the trellised plants. I've got a picture somewhere to show you. I'll look around for it and post. It's not pretty but it Was 100% critter proof. One day I'll just nicely fence in the whole area. At the time I was stuck and needed a quick solution with whatever I had on hand.
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Post  JK on 2/1/2012, 10:44 am

Thanks that would be great Smile Im terrible without visual aids lol.

Only thing Im missing now is my conduit and netting for the trellis, one more bag of vermiculite, and that elusive fifth type of compost...

A co-worker may be bringing me some horse manure by but I dont know that I trust it to go in to my mix without aging/composting it for a month or two. Im still trying different feed and seed stores to hopefully stumble across something new. So far I have gotten Cow, Hen, Worm, and Mushroom.
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Post  llama momma on 2/1/2012, 1:29 pm

JK-
OK found the picture. The box on the left is the 4 x 8 with two critter cages and the trellis is on the right.
You should see the cinder blocks on the left of the box and the chicken wire wrapped around the green metal poles on the right that protects the trellis. Like I said not pretty but it served my purpose to keep out deer, cats, bunnies, etc.
It's not a closeup picture, but maybe you can see anyway?
New Garden Construction/Planning - Page 2 Gina_s25
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Post  Furbalsmom on 2/1/2012, 2:22 pm

JK, my favorite seed source is Territorial Seeds, though I also purchase seeds at various stores. Territorial is close enough (80 miles but on my way to "The Big City" of Eugene, OR) that I can get there once a month or so. However, I am no longer allowed to go there without adult supervision. Shocked I tend to buy more packages of seed than I even have squares.

They have several varieties of Bush Beans

BUSH BEANS
Since I like lots of colors in my beans, I grew Royal Burgundy, Carsons and Nash Bush Beans.

They also have the Bush french filet style of beans (long and skinny)
FRENCH FILET
I grew Soliel and then a Burpee Brand Garden Bean, French Filet

In most warm areas, Snap and Snow peas will only grow and produce in Spring, they cannot tolerate much heat, so perhaps you could even grow peas on your trellises, then pull them out when it is time to transplant your warm weather crops.

Most peas vine, but some are only 20 - 30 inches
SNAP PEAS
Snow Peas also vine, again some varieties are 20 - 36 inches.
SNOW PEAS
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Post  JK on 2/2/2012, 8:45 am

Llamma Mamma - That looks great Smile How high is your trellis?

Furbalsmom - Thanks for the bean info, once I get everything picked im going to post specific types and spacings for a review from everyone before I commit to dirt Wink

I have seen people talk about the seed packets being so attractive and addicting... they just put them out at Ace and Lowes and now I understand what everyone means. I wanted one of everything bounce. So many plants and so few squares....
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Post  llama momma on 2/2/2012, 9:10 am

[quote="JK"]Llamma Mamma - That looks great Smile How high is your trellis?

Thanks JK - the trellis was made exactly as described in Mel's book with 5 ft. tall electrical conduits. I took the book to home depot and showed a guy the picture of the parts. He got the parts for me, cut the pieces, got the rebars and elbows too.
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Post  JK on 2/9/2012, 10:20 am

So time is flying by and I think I should be planting pretty soon. I am making progress on my fifth type of compost but I dont know that I will have it or have it ready in time. How much trouble will I be in if I stick to the 1/3 ratio using 4 types of composts and then add in small amounts of a fifth type as it is available/ready?
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Post  llama momma on 2/9/2012, 11:08 am

As long as the quality of composts are good it should be just fine. I would promise myself to keep my eyes open for more varieties. If you find more than 5 sources get those too. And remember no two compost heaps will be the same, yet in the end our gardens will be very happy with homemade compost... My first attempt at sfg was a fall garden with 4/5ths aged manure and 1/5th yard compost and everything in the fall season garden grew. A gift you can give yourself right now is not to stress over it, and as many others have said on this forum, compost will happen. Smile
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Post  JK on 2/9/2012, 11:25 am

Great, thats good news. I have my own compost pile going its just not ready yet. My co-worker should be getting me horse manure within a week or two but from the sound of it I will need to compost it before it can be used. Ive got 8cuft of vermiculite, two 2.2cuft bales of peat which I understand will fluff out to around 8cuft, and I have two bags each of cow, hen, mushroom, and worm. They are all fairly close to the same size and a couple list 1cuft. Figure this will give me my 1/3 ratio as long as I watch and dont get to much peat. Depending on weather and family issues Im going to try and get things built and mixed this weekend.
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Post  llama momma on 2/9/2012, 11:35 am

Glad to ease your mind JK. And it sounds like you are off to a great start. way to go
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Post  JK on 2/14/2012, 9:35 pm

So... Never in my life would have I thought I would be excited about someone bringing me poop. Co-worker came through with an entire bin full of horse manure and said anytime I need more she has all I could need! bounce Comparing to the bags of compost I've bought that say 1cuft, I would guess its probably 3cuft or more. Into the compost bin New Garden Construction/Planning - Page 2 3170584802
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Post  rod champion on 2/15/2012, 12:19 am

Use some real live dirt for the first 6" - then do the MM. That is what i have done.

I don't see any illogical reasoning to it. You will only make the dirt rich for future use.
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Post  JK on 2/15/2012, 8:38 am

Rod - First 6" of what? The compost bin or the actual garden bed?
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Post  JK on 2/16/2012, 8:21 pm

Stopped by a feed and seed I hadnt seen before and right out front is black cow and another bag I wasnt used to seeing... Cotton compost, made in Georgia, 100% cotton plant parts, fully composted!bounce Now I have a full 5 for my MM and manure for my own compost pile. Between now and sunday I'll be building a new compost bin and 2 4x4 boxes with trellises. Only thing I havent got is the netting and I'll be ordering it online tomorow.
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Post  JK on 2/20/2012, 8:44 am

New Garden Construction/Planning - Page 2 Box10

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Weather wasnt exactly cooperative this weekend so I got the boxes put together in my out building. Two boxes: 8" 4x4 and 12" 4x4. All the stuff for the mix, just gotta get it done during the week cause it seems to wait for the weekend to rain Sad

The blue tote is completly full of horse manure. Just waiting for the boards that were out in the rain to dry off before building my new compost bin. Also picked up a big bag of coffee grounds this morning from a girl I know at a local coffee place sunny
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Post  quiltbea on 2/20/2012, 12:22 pm

Lookin' good!
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Post  JK on 2/27/2012, 9:33 am

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Took longer than I hoped but I finally had a weekend with a little sunshine. Both 4x4, one 8" and one 12". Planted carrot, radish, beet, spinach, and several different lettuces. Waiting to get broccoli, tomato, and peppers as transplants.

I have some peas I was given that are apparently vine type, would it be to crowded to plant them in the back in the same square as tomato?
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