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Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone?

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Post  yolos on 2/25/2012, 11:34 pm

Furbalsman - I just tried to post an answer to you question about mixing the peat when it is wet but the post did not show up here. Maybe I forgot to hit send ??Embarassed Hope my post does not show up twice.

But to answer your question, "in the old days" we used to put the peat moss in a wheel barrow (sp) and start adding water. Then massaged (kneaded) the peat moss until the water was absorbed. Then added more water and massaged again, repeating this until the peat would no longer take up any more water. So I am very used to working with wet peat. Most of the bagged compost that I purchase is also somewhat wet so one more wet ingredient does not bother me. My main goal is to make absolutely sure that the peat is thoroughly wet.
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Post  Furbalsmom on 2/26/2012, 12:13 am

yolos. I only see your post once. Very Happy

The final goal is peat moss that is well rehydrated. That has been a problem for many. But, you do want to measure it dry. If mixing it wet is easier for you, that is great.

I would not have been able to move the completed Mel's Mix to the SFG bed (mine are Table Tops) if the peat was already wet. But then, I am a big old wimp Razz
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Post  walshevak on 2/26/2012, 7:06 am

And I am an older one. Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 656620 +1

Kay

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Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 Empty free mushroom compost

Post  hatcherdm on 2/26/2012, 12:18 pm

While visiting my daughter recently, found a place where you can fill as many bags of compost free of charge from Hy-tech Mushroom Compost Inc located in West Grove, Pa. It is a mixture of wheat straw, straw bedded horse manure, hay (most commonly orchard and timothy), poultry manure, cotton seed hulls, cotton seed meal, cocoa shells, and gypsum. It is delightfully pungent!
You can also purchase it by the cubic yard (typically truck bed) for $25, but we filled 4 of the large contractors garbage bags full of the stuff for free--course the stuff was so heavy we had to use the tractor front loader to unload it!
Hy-Tech Mushroom Farm, Inc.
155 Valley Road
P.O. Box 390
West Grove, PA 19390
Marketing/Sales : 610-331-1849
Tours and self-pickup : 610-869-0202
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Post  snibb on 3/6/2012, 7:02 pm

An excellent post with all the necessary information on the importance and the "why" of Mel's mix. Thank you-I enjoyed the read
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Post  AngelaNC on 3/6/2012, 11:47 pm

I have 4 out of five composts - cow manure, chicken manure, mushroom, and forest. So far the only other one I can find locally is from yard waste facility. My fear is that it will be too much like the forest one - what do you all think?

My problem is figuring out how to measure compost that came in a bag that is labeled for weight(lbs) instead of volume(cf)? Also, what if I get some bulk materials? Should I look for or make a box that is 1cf in size and use that to measure?

Thanks,

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Post  snibb on 3/6/2012, 11:51 pm

I like to use those colored Rubbermaid tubs that you can buy at Target or Kmart or Wal-mart type of stores. They probably cost $10 and last forever. They have tow pieces of rope attached to each side so that you can pick it up. I think you know what I'm talking about. I will fill one completely up with peat moss, one with vermiculte, and one with compost. It's not enough to do a full 4X4' box, so I then start to fill it up again and only go half way up the tub. That should give you the same amount by volume
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Post  Furbalsmom on 3/7/2012, 3:46 pm

Angela, snibb has a great suggestion regarding measuring to make sure you have equal volume of each major ingredient. Those totes are easy to use.

Personally, I am a wimp and need to use 5 gallon buckets, because I know I can lift those.

We have a member that "estimated" a 40 lb bag of compost would be equal to approximately 0.75 cu ft and a 50 lb bag of compost approximately 1 cu ft. Since each type of ingredient would be different, this was used to estimate volume for the purpose of buying enough. I used this estimate to calculate how many bags I would need and ended up having sufficient volume.

Hope that helps.
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Post  walshevak on 3/7/2012, 8:55 pm

For purchasing purposes, 25lbs is in the neighborhood of 1/2 cu ft. maybe a bit more. The only compost bag I saw last year that had both pounds and cu ft marked on the package was a 40 lb (.75 cuft) bag. That's why a measuring bucket is best for mixing.

When I got ready to purchase my composts, I "ESTIMATED BASED ON THE 40 LB BAG"

50 LBS = 1 CU FT

40 LBS = .75 CU FT

20 LBS = .5 CU FT

Remember, if you overestimate on the compost purchase, the remainder of the blend can be saved for the "trowel full" you add when replanting.

kay

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Post  AvaDGardner on 4/19/2012, 11:52 pm

Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 43549
I'm so glad I found this last post! I was calculating pounds to cf all wrong.

Here's the question I'm struggling with:

How much does Mel's Mix weigh? Does MM weigh the same as soil?

I'm working on the proposal for TTs the nursing home. It's one of those little details I hope to compare of why MM over Miracle-Gro(R) soil (preferred by a staff member).
(I've already covered concerns over both synthetic fertilizers and perlite. If you have any other ideas, look for another thread.)

Thanks

Ava
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Post  camprn on 4/20/2012, 7:04 am

@AvaDGardner wrote:Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 43549

How much does Mel's Mix weigh? Does MM weigh the same as soil?



Ava
I think it depends upon how much water is in the mix. I think water weighs about 8# a gallon.

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Post  AvaDGardner on 4/20/2012, 12:44 pm

Yes, I believe water is 8lbs per gallon. Let's take that out of the equation. Water is a variable in both soil and MM.

How heavy is MM?

3 cubic yards of soil is approximately 1 Ton. How does MM compare in weight?

Is it the same as soil?

Ava
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Post  boffer on 4/20/2012, 1:47 pm

My dry MM (mixed but not watered) weighs 20 pounds in a full five gallon bucket.

The amount of water needed to properly saturate MM is fairly consistent compared to that needed for 'soil'.
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Post  AvaDGardner on 4/20/2012, 5:16 pm

@boffer wrote:My dry MM (mixed but not watered) weighs 20 pounds in a full five gallon bucket.

The amount of water needed to properly saturate MM is fairly consistent compared to that needed for 'soil'.

Thank you Boffer!

And a 5 gal bucket is .5 CUs, per walshevak's post on 3/17/12.

Check me on this please...Mel says on pg 100 with 6" of mix that:
(W*L)/2= Cubic Feet.
2*3 (mixing tubs)= 6/2 = 3 CF.
20lbs = 0.5 CU (per Boffer)
3/0.5 = 6 (There are 6 units of 0.5CU per 3CF)
6*20 (lbs) = 120lbs per 2x3 mixing tub.

Did I do that correctly?

Ava
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Post  AvaDGardner on 5/1/2012, 8:17 pm

No double checkers on the math?

Mel talks about the boxes being so movable. If my calcs are right, and a 4x4=8cf (per Mel)

then wouldn't a

4x4=16/2=8cf

8cf/0.5=16 buckets

16*20lbs (per 5 gal bucket) = 320lbs.



Unless you have boffer's cool wheely garden, isn't that much weight rather unmovable?

Ava
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Post  plantoid on 5/1/2012, 8:24 pm

@boffer wrote:My dry MM (mixed but not watered) weighs 20 pounds in a full five gallon bucket.

The amount of water needed to properly saturate MM is fairly consistent compared to that needed for 'soil'.

Mine was about that as well Boffer and we're a few thousand miles apart using different material no doubt . Once wetted well and left over night , a two gallon bucket of it is all I can haul around. So for me it was a no brainer to mix it and transport it to the beds as dry as I could get it ...... within reason.
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Post  plantoid on 5/1/2012, 8:31 pm

@AvaDGardner wrote:Yes, I believe water is 8lbs per gallon. Let's take that out of the equation. Water is a variable in both soil and MM.

How heavy is MM?

3 cubic yards of soil is approximately 1 Ton. How does MM compare in weight?

Is it the same as soil?

Ava



Ava where did you get the figures of 3 cu yards soil = one ton ?

I seem to recall that one cubic yard of clean washed damp building sand is about 7/8 of a ton and one cubic yard of impervious clay is only a tad heavier at one ton.
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Post  plantoid on 5/1/2012, 8:36 pm

@camprn wrote:
@AvaDGardner wrote:Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 43549

How much does Mel's Mix weigh? Does MM weigh the same as soil?



Ava
I think it depends upon how much water is in the mix. I think water weighs about 8# a gallon.



English rhyme:-

A pint of pure water weighs a pound and a quarter .

So yes , an imperial gallon ( not your USA short measure ones Wink ) will weigh 8 pounds per imperial gallon
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Post  boffer on 5/1/2012, 8:57 pm

@plantoid wrote: So yes , an imperial gallon ( not your USA short measure ones Wink )

plantoid, I'm thinking you must have some Texas blood in your pedigree! Razz
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Post  camprn on 5/1/2012, 9:04 pm

So....wait.... a pint is a pound the whole world round..... but is only true in the US? Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 601593

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Post  AvaDGardner on 5/2/2012, 1:31 am

@plantoid wrote:
@AvaDGardner wrote:Yes, I believe water is 8lbs per gallon. Let's take that out of the equation. Water is a variable in both soil and MM.

How heavy is MM?

3 cubic yards of soil is approximately 1 Ton. How does MM compare in weight?

Is it the same as soil?

Ava
Ava where did you get the figures of 3 cu yards soil = one ton ?

I seem to recall that one cubic yard of clean washed damp building sand is about 7/8 of a ton and one cubic yard of impervious clay is only a tad heavier at one ton.

3CY=1T came from my DH...and he's never wrong. Laughing

I did research a lot looking for details...this is from my notes...




moist 90lbs/ft
wet 100lbs/ft
dense 125lbs/ft
clay weighs more than sand (particial density matters)
http://cadlab6.mit.edu/2.009.wiki/anchor/index.php?title=Cubic_yard_of_dirt


and
the average density of soil is 120-125lbs per CF
(not referenced)


and
compaction matters. 13 lbs per gal for loose soil
www.convert-me.com/en/bb/viewtopic

So...let's take moist as the standard. MM should be moist, not wet.

90lbs per ft * 3 (to make 1 CF) = 270lbs per 1CF.

* 3 (to make 1 CY) = 810 lbs

* 3 (to make 3 CY) = 2430 lbs
(one short ton = 2000 lbs)

Okay...the DH underestimated if my calcs are correct.

Are they?

Ava

(Just saw this on the mit site: Since a cubic yard is 27ft'cubed', the weight of a cubic yard varies from 2430lbs to 3375lbs)

Which means the DH REALLY under-estimated!
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Post  plantoid on 5/2/2012, 8:02 am

3 X3 X3 = 27 Cubic feet in a cubic yard



Imagine the base area of 3 lots of 3 cubic feet , now climb up for three levels and you have three lots of nine which to me is 27 cubic feet ie . 3 x 3 x 3 = 27

Basically 27 x 100 is 2700 pounds which is just over an imperial ton of 2240 pounds and nearly 1 & 1/2 of an American ton which is ( short measure Wink ) only 2,000 pounds

The biggest banana skin in the bag is that soil composure varies so much a light friable soil is that is damp & great for growing would weigh far less than the wet sticky blue clay native clay we have around here even if it did have loads of compost and manures in it.

Is



Perhaps fill a one cubic foot cardboard box ( I made one with five panels of carboard measuring one square foot & duct tape ) with a can which you know hold a set number of pounds as weighed out contents then multiply the number of cans used by the weight of the contents of the can.
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Post  plantoid on 5/2/2012, 8:30 am

@boffer wrote:
@plantoid wrote: So yes , an imperial gallon ( not your USA short measure ones Wink )

plantoid, I'm thinking you must have some Texas blood in your pedigree! Razz



Nah,

More like the Texans have plenty of good honest quality Yorkshire blood coursing through them for apparently that's where many of them originated from a couple of hundred years ago . Laughing
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Post  Kelejan on 5/2/2012, 11:50 am

@plantoid wrote:Mel's Mix. How strong is your backbone? - Page 5 43549


English rhyme:-

A pint of pure water weighs a pound and a quarter .

So yes , an imperial gallon ( not your USA short measure ones Wink ) will weigh 8 pounds per imperial gallon

When I was at school in England I remember a gallon of water as weighing ten pounds. 8 pints x 1 /14 lbs = 10 pounds :scratch:
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Post  boffer on 5/2/2012, 12:03 pm

@plantoid wrote: Nah,
More like the Texans have plenty of good honest quality Yorkshire blood coursing through them for apparently that's where many of them originated from a couple of hundred years ago . Laughing

'Everything's bigger in Yorkshire' just sounds so...foreign! tongue


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