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1,000 worms on their way....

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Post  Thomas 1/24/2013, 10:01 pm

My worms arrived today. They were packed in dry peat and according to the instructions, would be dehydrated. They look pretty miserable. Very thin and small, and not really moving. But I put them in the worm factory per instructions and will see if they make it. They were in transport two full days from Harrisburg Pa and I don't know how much of the time they were in the cold.
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Post  GWN 1/24/2013, 10:08 pm

My worms arrived today. They were packed in dry peat and according to the instructions, would be dehydrated. They look pretty miserable. Very thin and small, and not really moving. But I put them in the worm factory per instructions and will see if they make it. They were in transport two full days from Harrisburg Pa and I don't know how much of the time they were in the cold.
OH I SURE hope that they make it.
SOOO glad that they are warm and in your house now.
You might be surprised once they warm up they might just perk right up.
GWN
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Post  Kelejan 1/24/2013, 10:17 pm

They'll make it, Thomas.
If not, then contact your worm supplier and he should send you some replacements.
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Post  llama momma 1/25/2013, 6:42 am

Thomas
When my worms arrived last March they were very thin and all balled up together. Like yours they were taken from their surroundings, mine traveled from Philadelphia area, jostled around which they really don't like, and without moisture. In their new moist environment they will plump up. As long as you have a little food in there and moist bedding they'll be fine. But don't expect them to eat much at all for the first 2-3 weeks. They need time to adjust.
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Post  Thomas 1/25/2013, 9:44 am

Thank you all for your input. I checked on them this morning, even though I guess you should wait about 3 days. But I was a bit concerned about how damp the bed was. The bed seemed damp enough. The worms are either sluggish or dead. There are a few moving about, so I am hopeful.
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Post  littlejo 1/25/2013, 9:55 am

My worms have been doing great, had them about 1.5 yrs. I'm looking forward to using the castings this spring. But I have a problem, which I think I mentioned before. I have snails, I had a few, and was told not to worry, but now I have hundreds. I know they probably won't hurt the worms, haven't yet! But, what about the garden? I already have snails/slugs in the garden, but these seem to be a different kind.
I use snail bait in the garden. Should I put this on the castings before adding to the garden? Will it hurt the worms? Anybody know about these? Here's a couple pics. These went down the drain, but picking them out is like trying to collect all the cocoons.
1,000 worms on their way.... - Page 15 Pic_0510
1,000 worms on their way.... - Page 15 Pic_0511
The largest is about 1/4 inch across. Jo
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Post  GWN 1/25/2013, 11:17 am

Thomas
When mine arrived they were very healthy but something happened shortly after, not sure what I did but the numbers rapidly dropped and many of them went down in the collection bin... they were NOT happy.

So for quite awhile I had very few, but then they gradually started reproducing and now I have TONS (one year later) I think that you should tell the company the situation and get more. But I am sure if some are surviving, that you might at least get some started. I have read that they take awhile to adjust to the new situation.
GOOD LUCK
GWN
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Post  GWN 1/25/2013, 11:21 am

Littlejo
Those little shells look so cute.
I would guess that they will be a problem if they end up in garden, but I am curious to hear what others say.
I used to live in Oregon where we had those massive slugs and everyone is pretty familiar with what they do.
Here we have very tiny ones in the garden and they are very hard to find and they do just as much damage as the big ones, its just they are sneakier. THAT IS if the ones we are talking about are the same. Our slugs do not seem to have shells, and they are born from white eggs that I often find when I turn up plastic that is down on the ground.

Again I am quite curious so hope someone else has some ideas, i can go and check my "worms eat my garbage" book
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Post  GWN 1/25/2013, 12:17 pm

OK, I looked it up in the book and all she said was that the did not harm the worms
But I found this online and suggested like you said that they will harm the garden and it makes suggestions to get rid of them

http://www.soyouwanna.com/snails-vermicompost-36524.html
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Post  llama momma 1/25/2013, 1:53 pm

Thomas
I agree with calling the supplier and letting them know the condition of the worms. Unfortunately our region has been so cold the past couple days. Also if you are so inclined you could take a head count and compare it to how many you paid for. Gloves are recommended!

littlejo
Snails??!? That's a new one for me. What the heck how did they get in there? You have redworms or something else from the garden?
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Post  littlejo 1/25/2013, 4:29 pm

LM, I used to have them outside the 1st summer, but brought them in the 1st winter. They've done so good that I just left them in the spare bathroom. I first noticed them(just a few) a couple months ago. I don't know what kind of snail they are, but I may have got them on some produce that I bought, or maybe they were in the cardboard boxes. I found the most on some cardboard in the bin. They are very small and I've never seen this kind out in the garden. I think I will try to identify the kind of snail they are, then email my worm guy and see if he knows what I should do about it
Really makes me mad cause I have about 15 gal. of castings to use, but they won't go in garden, maybe as worm tea only.
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Post  llama momma 1/25/2013, 5:36 pm

Wow.
In the book (pg 97) Worms Eat My Garbage the author shows a pic of snails. Says they are first level consumer, just like the redworms, this would make them a competitor. But like you said, need to find out what kind they are. Still I wonder - if the snails could be sifted out of there if the compost was dried out a little? Just a thought.
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Post  GWN 1/25/2013, 5:44 pm

That article said you could make a moat around them I wonder if they got in your worm farm while it was outside and laid eggs.
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Post  littlejo 1/25/2013, 8:00 pm

As far as sifting, well, the largest is 1/4 inch, the smallest ones are maybe 1/16 inch? I guess it can be done, but I think I will sort out my worms, maybe even rinse them, and put the castings, etc, on the porch where we are now getting some freezing weather.

I'm going to all snail sites on the net to try to identify these snails. There is 1 that is flat like these, and they eat the larger snails? That would be ok , but being sure is the problem.

I think making a moat, or getting to the bin would make it almost not worth it having worms.

I may have gotten them from compost, which I think I added some in the fall, and I was adding all sorts of stuff to the compost bin, leaves, grass, and other yard debris. I don't inspect,with a magnifying glass, everything I put in worm bin, but, I do usually freeze most things now. I guess we have to learn as we go, and if I'm going to worry about this, then in my next bin, I will freeze or microwave everything that goes in the bin.
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Post  llama momma 1/26/2013, 12:04 am

littlejo wrote:I may have gotten them from compost, which I think I added some in the fall, and I was adding all sorts of stuff to the compost bin, leaves, grass, and other yard debris. Jo

Oh boy..a little over a week ago I added compost and leaves etc. for the very first time. Curious to see if new inhabitants arrive affraid . Next time I'll freeze it first like you mentioned.
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Post  Turnip 1/26/2013, 12:28 am

Those snails look like pond snails! We had them at the old house (just moved here 6 weeks ago)..they arrived with a pond plant and escaped into the garden. They didn't seem to cause much trouble..not like the 'escargot' type snails we have here in CA.

1,000 worms on their way.... - Page 15 1280598131 Turnip
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Post  llama momma 1/26/2013, 12:43 am

I found a snail question to Bentley Christie from redwormcomposting.com. Hope this helps! llama momma

Here is an interesting email from Liz:

I’m new at this composting and have set up a 25 gal trash
bin with lid outside. Put several holes on the bottom and sides. Have
been adding kitchen scraps,newspaper and cardboard,coffee grounds,
etc… of course ~ 1000+ red wigglers and things looked good, then all
of the sudden I was getting ants, snails and now it appears that the
bin in infested with brown maggots and you can here them crawling
around. What have I done wrong? Have you heard of this problem? And
what do with what’s in the bin? Help!
Thanks!
Liz

Wow, Liz – sounds like quite the invertebrate party going on in your worm bin!
It all comes down to the one key word I saw in your msg: “OUTSIDE”!Outdoor systems are – not too surprisingly – far more prone to invasion from any number of different critters, and the good news is that there aren’t all that many you really need to worry about.

I’m not a huge fan of ants, but I have loads of them on my property, and in most of my various outdoor vermicomposting systems – especially in the worm composting trenches. Rather than going on a ant-killing rampage however, I’ve opted instead to mellow out about their presence, and put more focus on creating the ultimate habitat for the worms. Thankfully, the ‘ultimate’ worm habitat isn’t all that thrilling for ants.

Ants prefer fairly dry conditions, so if you are keeping your worm systems fairly moist at all times, the ants will be far less likely to set up shop (ie nest). They WILL still venture into (and out of) the bin/bed, grabbing some food to take back home, but in all honesty this isn’t really something to worry about. That being saif, I should mention that there are some really aggressive/annoying species of ants (such as fire ants) that may warrant a bit more attention/prevention.

If at all possible, you might think about propping your bin up on legs or a pedestal in a tub of water – basically requiring that the ants (and other non flyers) swim across your moat in order to reach the bin. You also might try adding shallow dishes of syrup/honey mixed with borax nearby to act as a diversion (and eco-friendly ant killer).

As for snails – I’ve never really had any in my systems, although from time to time I’ll see some slugs. Again, definitely nothing to worry about here – unless we are talking about some crazy sort of carnivorous, worm-eating snails (I think they may actually exist, believe it or not). Your typical run of the mill garden snails and slugs on the other hand will likely just stick to feeding on whatever scraps you are adding. The water moat should work fairly well to keep them out as well.The ‘maggots’ are almost certainly some type of soldier fly larvae, and will not harm the worms either. They are in fact reported to be excellent composting organisms, and some experts say they work very well with Red Worms. If you want to discourage them and other bin critters in general, you MAY want to feed a little less, and add more bedding types of materials. Often, when lots of new critters appear in a worm bin it is the result of there being excess food – they are simply there to take advantage of an untapped food resource.

Bottom-line, Liz – what you’ve encountered is very normal, and the only thing you might be potentially doing ‘wrong’ is overfeeding (just a hunch on my part). Again, if you simply cut back on the feeding, and take some of the suggested actions mentioned above, I suspect that you will begin to see a reduction in the number of invaders in your bin.

Hope this helps!


Written by Bentley on August 4th, 2009
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Post  walshevak 1/26/2013, 5:51 am

The real question here is whether the snails would eat the living veggie plants if they were introduced to the beds. Sorry I don't have the answer.

I would try to find a way to heat up the worm castings to kill the snails and any snail eggs before putting it into my MM. Would also kill any worm eggs, but you should still have plenty in your worm bin.

Or just use the castings for compost tea making sure the "tea bag" is a fine enough mesh to keep the eggs from going through into my plants. An old sock or the leg of an old panty hose should do the job. I don't have enough castings to use as a part of the mix so depend on the tea method which gives the plants a real boost.

Kay

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Post  GWN 1/26/2013, 11:14 am

The real question here is whether the snails would eat the living veggie plants if they were introduced to the beds. Sorry I don't have the answer.
I agree, this was the problem with the worms eat my garbage book.

I wonder about trying to "Harvest" your castings. I learned from the book to put all your castings out on a large piece of cardboard with a light right over it. Divide the castings into 9 piles. WOrms will migrate down and concentrate at the bottom and centre of each pile and you gradually keep taking the top of the piles and the edges until all the worms have gotten to the centre. (this all works because worms always move away from the light)
I wonder what slugs do in this situation. I wonder if you were to do this to get the worms out of the stuff and then either heat what was left or Freeze it, that way you would have something without any organisms to add to your soil AND the worms to restart you worm farm.

OH and the other way to harvest is to put something really yummie on one side of the bed such as a big squash, and the worms will migrate over there over a period of several days and then you can take what is left out.
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Post  littlejo 1/26/2013, 11:47 am

I have found lots of info on snails, from you'all and on the net, but cannot identify, for sure, what kind they are. I think I'll harvest my worm out, rinse them, and start a couple new bins, with clean worms and clean bedding. I'll then let the castings set so worm cocoons can hatch(I hate to lose them) , then I'll just make worm tea, and see if the worm guys will write me back. I might put a couple lettuce plants in the castings, I know most snails like lettuce, maybe I can pick most out. I like the idea of heating/freezing the castings, but I think that would probably also kill off the good bacteria, etc that is needed in the garden. After most of the worms are out or hatched, and if I absolutely have to use in the garden, then I'll put some kind of organic snail bait on the castings. I don't know if this stuff kills the snails or just makes them leave. I believe it just makes them leave, for I've still got snails/slugs in my garden. If I forget to put out the snail bait, they come to attack.
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Post  GWN 1/26/2013, 12:32 pm

Just one thought.... littlejo
I think that the commmercial producers of compost must either heat or freeze the castings, as I never see any worms OR eggs in the castings I buy in bags.
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Post  littlejo 1/26/2013, 1:02 pm

GWN, I have never bought any here, but I don't think they do the heating/freezing here, the worm folks even recommend not sealing in an air tight bag, so the castings stay 'alive'. Do the castings you buy work as good to fertilize your garden? Do they heat/freeze all compost or just the castings?
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Post  GWN 1/26/2013, 1:27 pm

Although I will not have to buy them anymore, last year to get my SFG going, I bought a lot of castings and they were all sealed. In fact all the compost I bought was sealed. I figure you can get your beneficial microorganisms from your other composts.
I guess I am just saying to do this to get rid of your snails.
Just to be able to salvage this load of castings, I am not suggesting you do it all the time.
I will not heat or cool my castings.

Sort of sterilize the castings such that your garden will benefit from the nutrients in your castings, this year.
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Post  llama momma 1/30/2013, 4:40 pm

The last couple of weeks I started adding shredded leaves and llama manure to the smorgasboard. Wow, it gets eaten very quickly. If you saved any leaves this Fall give your worms this fine source of free food.
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Post  Thomas 1/30/2013, 5:09 pm

my replacement worms arrived today and they look alive and healthy. 1,000 worms on their way.... - Page 15 3170584802
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