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Adding Soil to Mel's Mix Toplef10Adding Soil to Mel's Mix 1zd3ho10

Hello Guest!
Welcome to the official Square Foot Gardening Forum.
There's lots to learn here by reading as a guest. However, if you become a member (it's free, ad free and spam-free) you'll have access to our large vermiculite databases, our seed exchange spreadsheets, Mel's Mix calculator, and many more members' pictures in the Gallery. Enjoy.

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Adding Soil to Mel's Mix

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Post  gspoerke 4/16/2018, 3:28 pm

Has anyone ever tried adding regular soil to Mel's mix?
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Post  trolleydriver 4/16/2018, 3:56 pm

Why would you want to do that?  I would advise against it.
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Post  gspoerke 4/16/2018, 4:25 pm

As I was researching the topic of raised bed soil mixes I came across a couple of articles that recommended using some top soil. They said that it would add some beneficial microbes and trace nutrients. In transplanting bedding plants into my regular garden (which I no longer have) I used a soil similar to MM except I added about 1/4 of regular garden soil. It seemed to work very well on transplants! It is also a lot cheaper than the other suggested ingredients in MM.
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Post  trolleydriver 4/16/2018, 5:52 pm

It's your garden to do with as you please but I don't think Mel Bartholomew (if he were alive) would agree with using garden soil in the MM.  What you really need is good compost, preferably home made. All the goodness is in the compost. By the way, Mel's original Square Foot Gardening technique used amended soil rather than Mel's Mix.
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Post  Turan 4/16/2018, 9:03 pm

I prefer good garden soil to which I add compost, and sometimes sand. Last year in the greenhouse I added peat to lower the pH, and perlite as a light substitute to sand. I guess that is approaching MM, but it still is not MM, and I do not call it that. If weight is not an issue (not for table tops) then I suspect a bed mix including good soil is better than strict MM. But I have not done the testing to prove that. Over the years the old compost becomes humus and old MM becomes basically good garden soil, especially if the some of the composts are mineral rich enough.

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Post  countrynaturals 4/17/2018, 1:51 am

gspoerke wrote:As I was researching the topic of raised bed soil mixes I came across a couple of articles that recommended using some top soil. They said that it would add some beneficial microbes and trace nutrients. In transplanting bedding plants into my regular garden (which I no longer have) I used a soil similar to MM except I added about 1/4 of regular garden soil. It seemed to work very well on transplants! It is also a lot cheaper than the other suggested ingredients in MM.
I thought microbes were missing in topsoil and that's why my first year garden was so pitiful. 2nd year was much better, after compost and leaf mulch had a chance to do their thing. (That garden is old school SFG -- no MM.) I have one ANSFG bed, but after that I went to "humanitarian" which is what Mel calls it when we use whatever we can get instead of expensive MM. In my case that meant leaves and rabbit poo. That bed has peas in it right now.
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Post  sanderson 4/17/2018, 2:32 am

GS, Welcome to the Forum from California! glad you\'re here All New SFG does not use dirt. That said, it is your garden and if you want to add some, that's your choice, of course. It is true that dirt contains microorganisms, but Mel's Mix will also develop lots of microorganism as it "matures". If you want to add a hand full or two of your dirt to a bed to inoculate it, that would make sense.

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Post  AtlantaMarie 4/17/2018, 7:39 am

Hi Gspoerke. Welcome from Atlanta, GA!

My take is that if you have GOOD garden soil to begin with, there's no harm in adding a little to the mix. But if you've got something like mine (red clay), it's not worth it...

I'll certainly encourage you to start your own compost pile! :-) That's where a LOT of good nutrients are going to come from.
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Post  trolleydriver 4/17/2018, 8:38 am

My apologies Gspoerke ... I should have welcomed you to the forum before responding to your question. So here it is "a big warm welcome from Ottawa, Canada".

I also hope my somewhat terse response to your question does not stop you from asking more questions and contributing to the forum.
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Post  No_Such_Reality 4/20/2018, 1:10 pm

Welcome!  

I've added soil to mine.  Ive found that it seems to help with water rentention and watering.

Ive had many struggles over the years with my MM primarily with watering and being water senstive have an issue with needing to over flood my beds daily during summer to keep them from creating dry dead spots.
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Post  yolos 4/20/2018, 7:31 pm

No_Such_Reality wrote:Welcome!  

I've added soil to mine.  Ive found that it seems to help with water rentention and watering.

Ive had many struggles over the years with my MM primarily with watering and being water senstive have an issue with needing to over flood my beds daily during summer to keep them from creating dry dead spots.
Me too.  Exactly the same problem.  I had soil in a few of my beds that I had before SFG.  Those beds stay moister than straight SFG.  But I have started following one of our members suggestions and that is to add compost before it is fully decomposed because it is more water retentive.
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Post  jimmy cee 4/20/2018, 11:07 pm

It all comes down to how healthy, sturdy, pest resistant, fruit or flower producing plant one wants.
Think of it this way, I am now.
After reading and understanding a little of the book  teaming with nutrients.
A seedling relates to a new born baby.
Our babies receive special food and vitamins to support healthy growth
Seedlings need the same.
Plants can and will grow in dirt, waste, trash, anywhere they can find a bit of nourishment, but how are they growing ?
Not nearly as good as one growing in a vital nutritious environment such as Mel's Mix.
Healthy plants resist many pests that trash them. (its an amazing fact as to how they do it)
Plants without that vitality cannot do that.
Healthy plants bear more and better fruits than unhealthy plants.
It all comes down to the vitality of a plant, where is it grown, how is it matured.
They may look the same...but they aren't.
Do the ultimate test.... take a full bed as you put it together with new plants.
Take half the bed, spray foliage with compost tea. soil drench with compost tea
In days, not weeks you will see amazing results, why ? microbe colonies are active and healthy.
They are in dirt also,
however when properly made compost is combined with the 2 other ingredients, I'll challenge anyone to show me a better growing medium...


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Post  sanderson 4/21/2018, 3:03 am

Say, Jimmy, are you hooked on microbes?

Yolos, I have started using my rough compost as mulch. When topped with chopped straw, the MM seems to stay moister in the heat of the summer than just plain straw.

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Post  jimmy cee 4/21/2018, 11:24 pm

sanderson wrote:Say, Jimmy, are you hooked on microbes?

Yolos, I have started using my rough compost as mulch.  When topped with chopped straw, the MM seems to stay moister in the heat of the summer than just plain straw.
Yes Sanderson, I am severely...first thing I did once I became settled here is start filling my tumbler. I wont be getting as much produce in this area, however I already have contacted neighbors here and have all their leaves in the fall.My family gives me lots of veggie cuttings, 3 teenagers and 3 adults...
This neighborhood is filled with 30 + year old trees. And everyone should know leaves from trees have equal or more nutrient content than manures. Thats because ever extending tree roots go deeper bring up nutrients into the leaves. Gardening for me now is just a by product of composting.
By the way it is written.... compost makes an excellent mulch...I am chopping all my straw now also...Great moves...
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